Web Hosting Forums

Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 24

This is a discussion on Yahoo Email Bounces - are we on the black list? in the Hosting Talk & Chit-chat forum
I've been getting a very large number of bounces from Yahoo when I send the email from Jaguar (I'm using sendmail). Eg 100 bounces (1/3 ...

  1. #1
    Loyal Client
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    170

    Yahoo Email Bounces - are we on the black list?

    I've been getting a very large number of bounces from Yahoo when I send the email from Jaguar (I'm using sendmail). Eg 100 bounces (1/3 of my yahoo email addresses).

    I get the error message:
    "This message was created automatically by mail delivery software.

    A message that you sent could not be delivered to one or more of its
    recipients. This is a permanent error. The following address(es) failed:

    [email protected]
    retry timeout exceeded"

    Almost all of the errors are 'retry timeout exceeded'. Whereas if the address was bad, they give you a different error message that says so.


    I tried out several of the bouncing email messages, and I didn't get an error when I sent the email using my ISP (Verizon).

    When I send using Jaguar, I get an error 24, 48, 72 hours after it fails, and then a final failure message.

    Has anyone else had trouble sending out email to yahoo addresses? Anyone with mailing lists or forums or other programs that use the Jaguar mail server? Is there a way of checking to see if we are on the Yahoo black list? (I looked and didn't find one).

    It is possible that my email list has a high rate of turnover and many email addresses are bad, but the real puzzle is if that is true then why I didn't get an error message when I send using Verizon!

  2. #2
    Ron
    Ron is offline
    Loyal Client
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Posts
    7,503
    I have been getting the exact same error when sending to .mac addresses.

    Senior support tells me that it is not our issue....

    After your post, I begin to think this is a JPC server problem.
    Good luck

  3. #3
    Loyal Client
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    170
    I just sent out 20 emails to Yahoo addresses using Verizon and haven't received any bounces. These bounced when I used Jaguar. I'll open a support ticket.

  4. #4
    Loyal Client
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    170
    Before I get the final error, I get these types of errors 24, 48 and 72 hours after sending the message:

    "This message was created automatically by mail delivery software.
    A message that you sent has not yet been delivered to one or more of its
    recipients after more than 24 hours on the queue on wolverine.nocdirect.com.

    The message identifier is: 1H3gcR-0000vq-8P
    The subject of the message is: Campus Activism : Tools for Student Activists News for 01-07-2007
    The date of the message is: Sun, 07 Jan 2007 16:35:59 -0600

    The address to which the message has not yet been delivered is:

    [email protected]
    Delay reason: SMTP error from remote mail server after initial connection:
    host g.mx.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.53.191]: 421 Message from (69.73.131.230) temporarily deferred - 4.16.50. Please refer to http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/mail/defer/defer-06.html

    No action is required on your part. Delivery attempts will continue for
    some time, and this warning may be repeated at intervals if the message
    remains undelivered. Eventually the mail delivery software will give up,
    and when that happens, the message will be returned to you.

  5. #5
    Yeah, I know a LOT! Vin DSL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Arizona Uplands
    Posts
    10,661
    Did you read this:

    http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/mail/bulk/bulk-01.html

    I.E.

    • Maintain accurate reverse-DNS information for your mail servers. Yahoo! Mail makes extensive DNS checks for each connection, and an accurate reverse DNS will ensure prompt processing of your connection and email.
    And, fill out these?

    http://add.yahoo.com/fast/help/us/mail/cgi_defer

    E.G.

    5. About the problem - Experiencing delivery delays
    And/or...

    http://add.yahoo.com/fast/help/us/mail/cgi_bulkmail


    Based on your message (above), and these pages, I have a *feeling* this is a Yahoo! issue...
    Last edited by Vin DSL; 01-14-2007 at 08:52 PM.
    DISCLAIMER Any resemblance between the views expressed above and those of the owners and operators of this system is purely coincidental. Any resemblance between these views and my own are non-deterministic. The existence of Vin DSL is questionable. The existence of views in the absence of anyone to hold them is problematic. The existence of the reader is left as an exercise in the second-order coefficient.

    No Guts, No Story! VinDSL 2010

  6. #6
    Loyal Client
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    170
    Yes I read that all.

    The problem doesn't just affect me. I presume it affects everyone sending email to yahoo addresses using the Jaguar mail server. I'm not sure if Jaguar just has one mail server or several.

    Note: can anyone else test this? I'd love to see a confirmation that others are having the same problem. You can write a simple php script to use the mail() function to send emails to some real yahoo addresses.

    I presume this is affecting hundreds to tens of thousands of Jaguar customers (how many customers does Jaguar have?) -- obviously most of which won't make much use of the mail server, but some of them will.

    I think it is unlikely that my piddly list of 300-400 email addresses has triggered the wrath of Yahoo, and more likely that someone else did.

    You could say it's Yahoo's fault for having a policy of some sort. Or it is Jaguar's fault for having users that abuse Yahoo. Regardless, both players are going to have to act if we are going to solve this.

    What I don't really appreciate it is when Jaguar Support tells me that I need to file a support ticket with Yahoo and places the responsiblity on me for this problem. Particularly difficult because some of the questions on the Yahoo form are hard for me to answer (one or more might require access to the mail server logs). In fact, I've identified a bug that, I presume, affects many other Jaguar customers and Jaguar support should be grateful and take up this matter on its own.

    So does anyone else have this problem? Want to check for me?
    I'd appreciate it...

    The sad thing is that I may have deleted up to 100 of my users' email addresses, falsely assuming that they had bad email addresses.

  7. #7
    Yeah, I know a LOT! Vin DSL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Arizona Uplands
    Posts
    10,661
    The thing is, I just did a lookup and it says your mail server fails reverse DNS entries for MX records. According to the help files at Yahoo, that's enough to delay delivery of your mailings. So...
    DISCLAIMER Any resemblance between the views expressed above and those of the owners and operators of this system is purely coincidental. Any resemblance between these views and my own are non-deterministic. The existence of Vin DSL is questionable. The existence of views in the absence of anyone to hold them is problematic. The existence of the reader is left as an exercise in the second-order coefficient.

    No Guts, No Story! VinDSL 2010

  8. #8
    Yeah, I know a LOT! Vin DSL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Arizona Uplands
    Posts
    10,661
    Looks like your server is also in violation of some RFCs...

    Your site is claiming to be on Wolverine, but the mail server is at a different IP.

    In view of all this (and more), I would guess that the anti-spam software at Yahoo suspects you're a perp...
    DISCLAIMER Any resemblance between the views expressed above and those of the owners and operators of this system is purely coincidental. Any resemblance between these views and my own are non-deterministic. The existence of Vin DSL is questionable. The existence of views in the absence of anyone to hold them is problematic. The existence of the reader is left as an exercise in the second-order coefficient.

    No Guts, No Story! VinDSL 2010

  9. #9
    Yeah, I know a LOT! Vin DSL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Arizona Uplands
    Posts
    10,661
    Hrm... That's strange!

    Wolverine is at 69.73.131.230, right?

    However, your mail server shows it's at another IP. I won't give that IP, in case it's yours, but when I did a search, it appears that IP used to belong to Wolverine, at some time in the past.

    LoL! This gets stranger by the moment...
    DISCLAIMER Any resemblance between the views expressed above and those of the owners and operators of this system is purely coincidental. Any resemblance between these views and my own are non-deterministic. The existence of Vin DSL is questionable. The existence of views in the absence of anyone to hold them is problematic. The existence of the reader is left as an exercise in the second-order coefficient.

    No Guts, No Story! VinDSL 2010

  10. #10
    Yeah, I know a LOT! Vin DSL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Arizona Uplands
    Posts
    10,661
    w00t! Hey, are you a vegetarian too?

    Veggies FTW!!!

    *edit*

    OOPS! A-l-r-i-g-h-t-y then! Now I got it...

    The better part of valor is discretion, yes?

    Heh!
    Last edited by Vin DSL; 01-15-2007 at 11:59 PM.
    DISCLAIMER Any resemblance between the views expressed above and those of the owners and operators of this system is purely coincidental. Any resemblance between these views and my own are non-deterministic. The existence of Vin DSL is questionable. The existence of views in the absence of anyone to hold them is problematic. The existence of the reader is left as an exercise in the second-order coefficient.

    No Guts, No Story! VinDSL 2010

  11. #11
    Old Hillbilly Connie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Hills of Missouri
    Posts
    2,491
    I quite using Jag a few months ago to send e-mail. I switched back to using my ISP.

    At the time I had no problems with Yahoo.

    AOL: customer did not receive e-mail part of the time. Sometimes they did. It was like flipping a coin.

    Hotmail. E-mail was sent to a spam folder.

    ComCast: All e-mail bounced but at least they provided a bounce notice.

    In reality what difference does it make if you send e-mail through Jag or your ISP. The average recipient will not know the difference.

  12. #12
    Ron
    Ron is offline
    Loyal Client
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Posts
    7,503
    I don't think I can easily train my forum and other software on my server to send emails through my home's ISP account.
    Good luck

  13. #13
    Old Hillbilly Connie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Hills of Missouri
    Posts
    2,491
    Good point Ron. That's not a problem I have.

  14. #14
    Loyal Client
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    170
    Vin - it isn't my server. I'm just on a semi-dedicated hosting plan at Jaguar. So it's the same mail server that Jaguar uses and is shared by who knows how many customers. My sites are hosting on wolverine and they use a different IP for the mail server (and that's about all I know about how it works).

    I think you are on to something with the DNS work!!!

    What did you use to find that information? I'd like to have something I could add to my Jaguar support ticket. They currently think the problem is with Yahoo.

    If anything should be kept relatively private, just PM it to me. Thanks!

  15. #15
    Yeah, I know a LOT! Vin DSL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Arizona Uplands
    Posts
    10,661
    Quote Originally Posted by akreider2 View Post
    What did you use to find that information? I'd like to have something I could add to my Jaguar support ticket.
    I used the left side of my [email protected]#$ brain. Sorry, but it's not on loan...
    Quote Originally Posted by akreider2 View Post
    If anything should be kept relatively private, just PM it to me. Thanks!
    Once again, sorry, but my PM quotient has been used up here, and I don't feel like cleaning it up, e.g. decide what to delete and what to save... Either Jag needs to give me more breathing room, or you guys are outta luck!
    DISCLAIMER Any resemblance between the views expressed above and those of the owners and operators of this system is purely coincidental. Any resemblance between these views and my own are non-deterministic. The existence of Vin DSL is questionable. The existence of views in the absence of anyone to hold them is problematic. The existence of the reader is left as an exercise in the second-order coefficient.

    No Guts, No Story! VinDSL 2010

Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •